How long should I age my beer?

[Bill]

I have a 1.078 OG/1.022 FG Stout and a 1.067 OG/1.018 FG IPA sitting in 2ndary in my fridge at ~36? F. The Stout has a pronounced alcohol taste at the end and the IPA has a slight alcohol taste.

From what I've read, higher gravity beers need to age longer to get the flavors to blend. How long would you suggest I age these beers to give a nice balanced flavor?

Should I add more bittering hops when doing high OG brews?

Should I have added more low fermentable grains (dextrin malts) to add a sweet flavor to help cover the alcohol taste?

What is a good way to make higher OG brews without having it finish like Listerine? Should I not let it ferment down as low as I did?

[Blktre]

Bill,
You asked some fantastic questions and the answer(s) your looking for isnt as simple as a quick answer warrants. There are multiple things to consider. So, i will do my best.
OG, Conditioning time, and Temp. are all related. The warmer the temp. the faster the conditioning. So the opposite is true as well. Big OG beers can take months to fully condition. So i suggest studying the style your brewing and let your pallet determine when its ready. What i usually do is secondary for a period of time as cold as i can get it. This allows the dead yeast and junk to fall out faster clearing the beer. Once satisified, you can move to keg and carb. Carbonation really doesnt effect aging of the beer, so the beer will still run its course. Your Impy Stout can easily go 3 months before your flavors balance out. Bigger beers can double that amount and longer.

As far as listerine/rocket fuel question. Again, study the style. Mash temps and thickness play a key role in fermability. I prefer my Stouts (Oatmeal, Sweet) etc. to be on the top end of the style, say a OG of 1.060-62 and finish at 1.018-20. I still pitch big and areate/w pure o2 so youd think id attenutate more than that, right? Mash higher. I mash these beers at 154*. Higher mash temps make a less fermatable wort profile(sweet) while low mash temps create a high fermatable profile (dry). Alts by style attentuate high so i mash at 146-149* tops. See the difference here??

Always add more bittering hops the higher the OG is. And again, style dictates ( i said dictates ) the amount of bittering to use. A easy way to understand this is to use the BU:GU ratio. Which is Bittering units to Gravity units. I can go into great length on this and the best thing to do is grab "Designing Great Beers" by Ray Daniels and he will throw down some quick and easy formulas to help you understand that ratio and how to correlate that into the different styles. Think ill stop there and let that soak in, then we can go from there.........hope this isnt a repeat of what you already know....Cheers...

[Bill]

Andy,
Thanks for the response! I know, my questions are getting harder to answer, aren't they?

OG, Conditioning time, and Temp. are all related. The warmer the temp. the faster the conditioning. So the opposite is true as well. Big OG beers can take months to fully condition. So i suggest studying the style your brewing and let your pallet determine when its ready. What i usually do is secondary for a period of time as cold as i can get it. This allows the dead yeast and junk to fall out faster clearing the beer. Once satisified, you can move to keg and carb. Carbonation really doesnt effect aging of the beer, so the beer will still run its course.

So, if I were to leave both these brews in my fridge for say a week at ~36? F basically just to clarify and drop out all the yeast, once I move the beer to a keg I can leave it pressurized (say only 3-4 lbs) at room temp (my basement ranges from 66? to 72? F) and it would/could/should condition at a faster rate? I guess it makes sense as all movement/reactions slow down at cooler temps.

You are right though, I need to start utilizing the Guild library and actually start doing more reading. I've been focusing all my energy on getting the basics down so I can start brewing beer that doesn't make people write "would not have again" on a score sheet. (which was a just response. I ended up dumping most of that batch. pity...)
I think I have my process down as far as being able to hit my efficiency %, getting a consistent mash/sparge temp and other 'basics'. I think that now I need to learn that beer isn't beer, each style has its own characteristics which dictates (now I said dictates ) how to fine tune the brew.


Thanks for the reply, again...

Cheers for beers!

[Blktre]

Bill,
On a personal level, i dont like my beers to go thru temp swings. Is there any reason why you want to cold condition, then store in kegs at warmer basement temps? Do you have the room for serving kegs and secondary vessels in your fridges? If not, id say to go ahead and secondary in glass or keg at basement temps. then crash chill for a few days, then rack to serving keg and keep at serving temps. That way its a gradual decline in temps and not a swing. But, thats just me....
One of the biggest challenges in volume brewing is having the space to keep things fermented at the proper temps (a must anyway), space to cold condition and serve. Hence the walkin!! Add lagers to the mix, and your constantly tripping over those, w/ added cus words! Keep up the good work!

[Bill]

Do you have the room for serving kegs and secondary vessels in your fridges?

I just got a beer fridge like 2 months ago. I think adding another one so soon would probably land me in the doghouse!

Thanks for the added info. I'll start leaving them at room temp in 2ndary for aging, then cold crash a few days before moving to the keg for cold storage/serving.

[Piscator]

Great post! This is what a brewing forum is all about. Kind of like a good brew - complexity adds to the overall impression. But I digress...

One other factor that you may want to consider Bill, is the effect of the apparent attenuation of the yeast you are using. Lately, I've been trying out lower attenuating yeast (as opposed to higher mash temps) for my big beers. This definitely helps prevent the overly dry finish, but not all yeast styles come with a selection of attenuation levels (White Labs California Ale 001 and California Ale V comes to mind) and there is a difference between the less fermentable wort vs. not fermenting as completely.

As far as aging goes, I find myself enjoying "young" ales that should be traditionally conditioned for longer periods so much that the beer never reaches "maturity." Not so, for lagers, however.

Right or wrong answers are tough to come by, so read up, try it for yourself and have fun brewing!

[Blktre]

Great post! This is what a brewing forum is all about. Kind of like a good brew - complexity adds to the overall impression. But I digress...
One other factor that you may want to consider Bill, is the effect of the apparent attenuation of the yeast you are using. Lately, I've been trying out lower attenuating yeast (as opposed to higher mash temps) for my big beers.

While were talking about that, i too look at the attenutation of a yeast when picking a style to brew. But i also pair this aspect of the chosen strain w/ mash temps. I try to blend the two factors togther. But Daves right, it doesnt make sense to make a big beer and pitch a low attentuative yeast on it. It may not end up what your looking for depending on style and OG. But again, imo, choose your yeast and mash temps wisely. If you screwd your mash temp at dough in and came in low, say in the mid 140's and your using say 1056, id expect a low FG.......and if you just made a Oatmeal Stout, you may want to call it a Dry Stout instead....and what really sux in that scenerio is you over used your bittering hops.....i big ol dry beer thats overly bitter doesnt work for my pallet to well. And this can really put up front your rocket fuel expecially if you fermented to high.......so, control your controllables and all will be well........kinda went off topic there and flew around a bit, but its all related....Cheers...