Lawrence Brewers Guild

Im upgrading my simple stove top extract brew "system" to a three tier gravity system and have encountered numerous options. Since I only want to do this once and minimize costs, I am trying to find the best cost effective (a.k.a. cheap) method the first time around. As a result, I have a series of questions that are open for input.

System plan summary: Three stair-step tiers framed with 2x4's resting on an extra clost door I had in my garage.
top- 6 gallon aluminum hot water tank with base level at 62 inches (on top of propane burner)

middle - Mash/lauter cooler- top at 58 inches, bottom at 42 inches

bottom- wort boil- coverted keg kettle- top at 38, bottom at 14 inches (on top of propane burner).

After the wort boil, I will transfer the wort through a wort chiller submersed in an ice bath to my fermenter on the ground (about 20 inches below hot wort base).

so...

1. sparging. I have read a lot about Phill sparge arms and they seem a nice convenience but I often hear the importance of the height of the hot water tank above the arm to provide sufficient pressure to rotate the arm... Any comments on this or is the whole Phill's arm thing an un-necesary perk that could be bypassd with a small coil of copper considering ther is not much vertical distance (only about 4 inches) between my hot water and sparge outlet.

2. Is a 5 gallon "orange GOTT cooler" sufficient for most common mashes, or is it worth investing in a 10 gallon. I have seen a 7 gallon at Target for $40 that may be a compermise. I am thinking that by using a 5 gallon I could brew most batches (even average 10 gallons), and if I need extra fermentables, I can use cans of liquid extract or DME.

3. Manifold in the bottom of mash tun. Copper vs PVC? I have seen and read about both, but am currently leaning towards copper.

Any other comments, suggestions. I would rather get them pre-construction than discover them half way through.


Thanks, Mike

Fly sparging! Good for you! Heres my input...
Your heights seem fine. One safety thing to consider is to run some hook bolts thru the closet door to secure the turkey fryer stand. This way little bumps wont knock off hot water and burn the heck outa you. Make sure your pots sit on the stands fairly secure. If they dont, i can weld some pot holders on for you to make sure your burner/pot is secured and safe...

Remember when using gravity, nothing will come out of your pots w/o a hose attached to your spigots. So plan your height to this. Also, if you ever decide to use a cfc, w/o a pump, make sure your bottom kettle height is hi enuff to gravity the cfc and into the fermentor. May want to plan ahead on that if you do a 10g batch....speaking of 10g's...

I highly reccomend spending a few extra dollars now so you can go 10g. Otherwise you will end up spending twice that amount for a upgrade from 5g. You can do 5g in a 10g rig, but not the other way. Also, you will be very limited in beers. A big beer wont be in your future in a 5g gott.

I use a copper manifold. You can use CPVC as its food grade, but stay away from PVC in your system. When building a bottom manifold you need to keep MT geometry in mind, expecially for fly sparging. Batch sparging you can use a single braid in the MT and get decent effenciency, but your eff. will be horrible fly sparging w/ a single braid as channeling of the grain bed is a huge problem. John Palmer on his free online "How to Brew" book shows how to build a proper manifold for your shape of MT, google search it as i dont have a link right now.

The Phils sparge arm is cute, and works, but totally unnecessary. Id spend my money and build a copper or CPVC upper manifold for your sparge water. As far as designs for the upper manifold, it can be almost identical to the bottom one.

IMO, spend the few extra bucks now and get equipment that can handle 10g. of a 1.060 to 1.080 beer or 8-9g of a 1.090 or bigger beer. This way you can go and stay all grain, spend tons less in ingriedents vs buying DME. Id think in 2 10g batches, you just saved your extra equipment costs and ingredeint cost by going bigger and all grain. Your welcome to stop by and check out my stuff for ideas...

I concur with Andy's comments concerning safety, savings and 10g vs 5g . However, since you are looking to minimize costs and are set on making the jump to all grain, have you thought about the batch sparge option? You can get set up quickly and do a few all grain brews with very little expense and then continue on your path to fly sparge and multi-tier systems (if you see the need).

If I had not read Denny Conn's article on the simplicity of batch sparge and low cost of the cooler/SS braid MLT, I would not have started all grain brewing. The relative complexity and expense of a serious fly sparge system kept me from all grain for too many years. I may never go to a fly sparge system, since I am very happy with the current quality and cost savings of grain vs extract, but the option is always there.

Where ever your brewing leads you, I wish you the best of luck.

Here's a link to Denny Conn's website where he discusses batch sparging.
http://www.hbd.org/cascade/dennybrew/

You can also listen to an interview with Denny Conn on the Brewing Network.
http://www.thebrewingnetwork.com/index.php
You have to click on archives and find the Sunday Live Show on 8-13-06.

As much as i like Denny as hes done alot to get folks to go AG, its to bad the the false perception that fly sparging takes uber equipment and time and is a difficult task. All of that is just not true. I sincerly hope and ive said this to Denny and on all the other forums multiple times, that before anybody can make a judgement, they have better of mastered both techniqes...But Denny also knows that i appreciate his enthusiasm and his advice to get brewers over to the dark side..Did i mention hes a great brewer as well?

Personally I just want to see a shit load of our member go AG...but I'm like Andy in saying go fly. Go spend a session with someone doing a fly sparge and see how easy it really is. The only other real cost to it IMO is the pump and that makes the use of a CFC much easier. Do your home work and it's really not that bad on the pocket book!

Before we head down the path to "sparge wars" (as seen on every brewing forum on the net) let's go back to Mike's original post: "I am trying to find the best cost effective (a.k.a. cheap) method". Let's see, a $10 rectangular cooler, a $5 piece of SS braid, $2 worth of tubing and a few more bucks for clamps and such. Cheap and easy. Welcome to all grain brewing, Mike!